Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

For discussing the modifications needed for diesel vehicles to run with 2 tank veggie oil conversions.

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Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

Postby steubens » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:47 pm

Hi all, I have recently purchased a used Golden Fuel Systems conversion kit. Looks to be lightly used but a few years old as it only has the 3b HoH (no VO return bundled with the coolant hoses)... I would like to use the components of this kit along with a few other addons (extra filter, FPHE, VO return line, etc) to convert my 1986 300SDL.

Using some MB shop manuals, GFS installation instructions and a few good forum links I found (this one included http://www.burnveg.com/wvo-conversion.htm) I have come up with what I think will be a good solid system.

Im attaching the PNG of the diagram for your review. Please let me know what you think. All comments are welcome. I would like to perfect the design before I get started doing any work on the car.

Take a look at the questions I have on the diagram please and let me know what you think:
  • Aux coolant pump placement??
  • FPHE placement? Before or after supply valve?
  • Lift Pump? Suck or Push?
  • Injector Line Heaters? needed?
  • Need more temp guages
  • Using GFS 3b HoH for coolant and VO supply to engine compartment, planning to zip tie return VO line to 3b.. OK?

Thanks for looking! -Steubens

Heres a direct link to the image, since this forum doesnt seem to display large graphics very well :cry: https://www.lucidchart.com/publicSegments/view/50c264cb-4f00-400d-86a4-47d10abecb30/image.png

WVO Conversion Diagram v1.0.png
WVO Conversion Diagram v1.0.png (132.71 KiB) Viewed 701 times
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Re: Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

Postby SunWizard » Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:15 pm

Hi and welcome to the forum. The perfected and well tested design is at the link you gave above: http://www.burnveg.com/wvo-conversion.htm This same design I did on my truck is better for your mercedes for many reasons, discussed in that link. Here is the diagram from that page to compare:
Image
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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Re: Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

Postby SunWizard » Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:26 pm

steubens wrote:[*]Aux coolant pump placement??

Anywhere in the loop, but push is better than pull.
[*]FPHE placement? Before or after supply valve?

As close to the IP as you can get.
[*]Lift Pump? Suck or Push?

Use the stock lift pump as in my diagram, there are no add on pumps that are anywhere near as strong, cheap, available everywhere, simple, long lasting as the stock mercedes pump. Especially push through filters is better since much less chance of air leaks, and the filters last longer. Stock mercedes and dodge push through the filter.
[*]Injector Line Heaters? needed?

NO.
[*]Need more temp guages

No, I find my VO temp guage is not worth much since the WVO temp is always within 10F of the coolant. A good coolant guage is the best, and my stock mercedes and truck guages are good.
[*]Using GFS 3b HoH for coolant and VO supply to engine compartment, planning to zip tie return VO line to 3b.. OK?[/list]

No WVO return line needed with my diagram, it returns WVO back the supply line during purge which is much better.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
SunWizard
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Re: Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

Postby steubens » Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:32 pm

Great! Thanks for all the answers... why is no return VO line "much better"? Why do all the kits come with return lines then?

Also, I was looking at your diagram again... with my mercedes I feel like stealing the hot coolant from the front of the engine where the big hose goes to the top of the radiator might be better than stealing it from the cabin heater loop..?! Seems like the car already has trouble pushing enough coolant to the cabin heater core at idle (thats why MB included an aux pump with the SDL on that loop.. and mine happens to not work, so I dont get much heat at idle). Does this make sense? and I missing something? thanks again!
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Re: Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

Postby SunWizard » Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:46 pm

steubens wrote:Great! Thanks for all the answers... why is no return VO line "much better"? Why do all the kits come with return lines then?

Because they haven't thought of plumbing like mine, none I have seen are even close. Its better since it saves having all that extra hose and insulation, and saves heat that would be wasted keeping it hot.
Also, I was looking at your diagram again... with my mercedes I feel like stealing the hot coolant from the front of the engine where the big hose goes to the top of the radiator might be better than stealing it from the cabin heater loop..?! Seems like the car already has trouble pushing enough coolant to the cabin heater core at idle (thats why MB included an aux pump with the SDL on that loop.. and mine happens to not work, so I dont get much heat at idle). Does this make sense? and I missing something? thanks again!

You are missing that the hose to the radiator doesn't carry any hot coolant until the thermostat is open (very hot engine.) The cabin heater gets heat way before that, and will always be hotter since it doesn't have the thermostat cutting the flow on and off. Sometimes on mine the radiator never gets any hot coolant until an hour of driving, yet the WVO is hot after <5 minutes.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
SunWizard
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Re: Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

Postby steubens » Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:23 am

SunWizard, thanks! Excellent point about the plumbing savings and the Thermostat (I knew I was missing something there!)

I have revised my diagram and come up with something almost exactly like yours. But now I have new questions about it... any help would be appreciated. The more info you can share with this greenhorn, the better.. thanks! :D

Notes/Questions:
  • Is the underhood VO filter still needed even w/ Racor in trunk? My original thinking was its cheap and couldnt hurt, but it does complicate things a little and take up more space under the hood... Im thinking I may just drop it.
  • loop will push VO thru Veg filter repeatedly?! Is this an issue? the veg is already cleaned by the racor in the trunk...
  • Without separate return line & 4th valve to veg tank, returned (unlooped) VO will flow backwards thru Racor?! Im thinking I might need to run another valve and a return line becasue of this? thoughts?
  • Stock plumbed clear line to back of IP from Injector Return?! what is that for? do I need to change it? Im not sure if this is Just an SDL thing or what but I have a small clear fuel line that tees off the return to tank bolt on the diesel filter housing and it goes down behind and into the injection pump... (see the diagram below)
    so the flow is
    [injectors] >
    [bolt on filter housing] >>
    [return to diesel tank] & [return to back of IP]

Thanks again for any and all help here. -Steubens

https://www.lucidchart.com/publicSegments/view/50c34a29-8d08-4907-a361-30bf0a40476b/image.png
WVO Conversion v2.0.png
WVO Conversion v2.0.png (151.24 KiB) Viewed 693 times
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Re: Two Tank Conversion, Request for Comments (86 300 SDL)

Postby SunWizard » Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:20 am

steubens wrote:]Is the underhood VO filter still needed even w/ Racor in trunk? My original thinking was its cheap and couldnt hurt, but it does complicate things a little and take up more space under the hood... Im thinking I may just drop it.

Better to drop the racor, for the reasons I gave above, plus they don't get hot enough and don't remove water, and they are more messy and more expensive both initially and for replacement elements.
loop will push VO thru Veg filter repeatedly?! Is this an issue? the veg is already cleaned by the racor in the trunk...

No problem, its a good thing, called polishing. The cleaner the better.
Without separate return line & 4th valve to veg tank, returned (unlooped) VO will flow backwards thru Racor?! Im thinking I might need to run another valve and a return line becasue of this? thoughts?

Correct its not good to backflow a filter, another reason to drop the racor since its not worth the added complexity of another valve.
Stock plumbed clear line to back of IP from Injector Return?! what is that for? do I need to change it? Im not sure if this is Just an SDL thing or what but I have a small clear fuel line that tees off the return to tank bolt on the diesel filter housing and it goes down behind and into the injection pump...

Thats the IP return, the small line is the injector return. As I mention in the post you linked, all the returns need unhooked from going into the top of the stock filter. The returns are then both tee'd together and where it returns or loops to is switched with the return valve.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
SunWizard
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Posts: 1723
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:53 pm
Location: N. Colorado


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