1st Run on my new centrifuge

Collecting, filtering and dewatering of WVO SVO vegetable oil. For Biodiesel producers too.

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captured oil

Postby sacveggieguy » Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:23 pm

Sunwizard what does your oil look like when you capture it from the CF while running is it full of air like mine is lots of little bubbles when you look at it in a clear jar?

As always Thanks for your valuable help and info
Paul aka Sacveggieguy
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Still no crud

Postby sacveggieguy » Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:48 pm

Well after about 4 days of hoping to find crud I still cant find any junk in my CF. I found an air leak in my pump and fixed it then I ran it thru my CF for 2 hrs reached 140 deg at 90 psi and not a spec I am bummed I was hoping to find something but it is clean as a whistle and after I pumped my barrel dry I saw traces of water so I dont know I may give up this route. How dirty is the oil you guys are getting I have seen the crud you guys are getting and I dont get a speck The CF seems to be spinning up really well the oil is hot and im getiing good pressure right at the CF. I just dont know.

One frustrated greaser aka Sacveggieguy
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Re: captured oil

Postby SunWizard » Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:56 pm

sacveggieguy wrote:Sunwizard what does your oil look like when you capture it from the CF while running is it full of air like mine is lots of little bubbles when you look at it in a clear jar?

No visible air bubbles in mine, but it is slightly cloudy (probably air) that clears up within a minute or so. Less of that as it gets hotter ~160F.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
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Re: Still no crud

Postby SunWizard » Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:02 pm

sacveggieguy wrote:after I pumped my barrel dry I saw traces of water so I dont know I may give up this route. How dirty is the oil you guys are getting I have seen the crud you guys are getting and I dont get a speck

Water in the barrel means you don't have the pickup arranged right, or barrel tilt. From post 1 of the dieselcraft thread:
"Note that I tilt the barrel towards the output so that any water on the bottom gets sent into the CF. If you don't suck from the lowest point, there could be a pocket of water that settles out and keeps re-contaminating the dewatered VO. A cone bottom tank would be the best, but this was a lot cheaper. Here is a good way to test if you have a good barrel drain and tilt, pour an inch of water in the bottom and see if it all runs out the drain pipe. The suction should come from the lowest point, and the pipe should go continuously lower until the pump. Otherwise you could get a pocket of water in your pipes. This the most common problem I see now that many have tried to copy my design and "improve" it. "

You are the first I have heard of using CF to get nothing, we would need to see pics and more description of your rig to help diagnose.

How can anyone describe how dirty their VO is? The dirtiest VO I get will put a 1" thick layer in the CF after an hour run. Average is 1/4" layer in 1 hour, with a 45 gallon batch.

Unless your VO was already very clean to start with, I think you have some major problem, possibly your jets are clogged or the low pressure cutoff is stuck and the rotor isn't spinning at all. Have you tried to take the cover off after shutdown while you think its still spinning, just before it stops, not while at full speed?
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
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no crud

Postby sacveggieguy » Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:21 pm

Sunwizard I hope I am not being a pain and I really appreciate your time to help out here I will describe my rig to you. I pull my oil of the bottom into a carborator pump into pretty much the same plumbing I see that you built in your photos a 1500 120v water heater element is used teed in just like yours runs up the side of my barrel just like yours and the only difference that I see in our setups is yours. is hard piped into the CF and I use a Flexable hose going to the CF and my pressure guage is right at the CF Im using the same pressure relief valve that you use from Graingers. I saw some water in the bottom as i pumped out my barrel but now I remember i did not capture at my last shut down and I did not do a pan test after this last batch. Another thing is if I plugged a jet pressure goes way up and bleeds off at the pressure relief valve I know this because it happened to me and the reason why we put the pressure relief valve there in the first place right? And when it running i can tell its spinning up pretty good I can put my hand on it its humming along pretty good and takes a little while to spin down after shut down. So im torn between is my oil pretty clean to start with or is my CF defective? Im a pretty hands on guy VW and Benz Tech for over 20 yrs Installed my own conversion etc not a genius but no dummy either. One more thing all the oil I get is non PHO stuff so its all pretty liquid and just kind of dark. So tell me what do you think I am hoping that you the Guru of CFing may find something I am missing because I believe I am doing it right just not getting the results and finding the crud you guys are getting.

Again many Thanks for all your help.

Still lookng for crud. Sacveggieguy
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Re: no crud

Postby SunWizard » Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:30 pm

sacveggieguy wrote:I pull my oil of the bottom

Thats not enough description of that important part as I described above. There would never be water on the bottom if you did it like mine.

If the CF is spinning fast its not defective. If you overpressured it you could have bent the rotor top and then it wouldn't spin full speed but usually the oring pops out.

What brand and model? Where are you measuring your temps?
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
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CF

Postby sacveggieguy » Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:43 pm

The brand is a filterfuge FF25. What did I not describe? My barrel pickup comes off the bottom and I have it tilted so everthing runs to the pickup. What could be different than yours I have a barrel a a heater a pump a pressure guage a pressure relief valve a CF some plumbing and i used your photos and copied your design very close. And i measured the temps of the oil in the barrel.

Thanks again Paul aka Sacveggieguy

ps maybe i can tyr and post some pics but you will see that we have almost identical systems
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Postby David » Thu Apr 24, 2008 4:27 am

Is it possible that your jeans legs have really cleaned your oil?

Is it practical to " load" the oil with some " dirt" like say talcum powder or something to see if the CF pulls out contaminants you know are there?
Maybe you could pump something off the bottom of a dumpster and throw that in to test what the CF pulls out?
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Re: CF

Postby SunWizard » Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:57 am

sacveggieguy wrote:The brand is a filterfuge FF25. What did I not describe?

It could be something with the filterfuge brand, I have no experience with them. Is the pickup using one of the threaded holes in the barrel so its flush or lower than the barrel bottom? There must be something different for you to get water in the bottom.
My barrel pickup comes off the bottom and I have it tilted so everthing runs to the pickup. What could be different than yours I have a barrel a a heater a pump a pressure guage a pressure relief valve a CF some plumbing and i used your photos and copied your design very close. And i measured the temps of the oil in the barrel.

Measure the temps right before it goes in the CF. You did an inline heater like mine? If so its about 20F hotter after the heater than whats in the barrel, and this is much more effective, since you don't need to heat the entire barrel as hot.

Is your pressure guage oil filled? If not they can be very inaccurate in VO, causing your problem.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
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Postby sacveggieguy » Thu Apr 24, 2008 11:20 am

Again Thanks 4 your patience with me. Yes I did a inline heater just like yours fitted with a tee like yours, I tried 2 different guages with the same results approx 90 psi. So then my oil is closer to proper temps if im getting to around 140 in the barrel. I only found a small amount of water in the bottom of the barrel which I may have caused by not capturing the output on my last shut down. I may resort to adding talcum powder and see if it gets pulled out that should tell me if the CF is working properly.

Thanks Paul aka Sacveggieguy
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Postby SunWizard » Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:11 pm

Add flour its cheaper and I know it gets removed since one of my sources breads their stuff with flour and I remove lots of it.

Both your guages are equally inaccurate if they aren't oil filled, which you didn't answer.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
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Postby canolafunola » Sun Apr 27, 2008 10:44 pm

Quote "and i used your photos and copied your design very close. "

Which photo did you copy? I hope not the same photo that I copied because the photo is not the way you should plumb the pickup. I was able to make mine work by making some mods.
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pickup

Postby sacveggieguy » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:21 am

My pick up hardware is on the outside of the barrel using a flange and a gasket and the hole is the lowest part of the barrel. The barrel is tilted towards the hole. What photos are you talking about? I was using Sunwizards photos showing the plumbing but i didnt see any showing how he plumbed the bottom.

Thanks Paul aka Sacveggieguy

ps I am using liquid filled guages
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Re: pickup

Postby SunWizard » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:40 am

sacveggieguy wrote:I was using Sunwizards photos showing the plumbing but i didnt see any showing how he plumbed the bottom.

Thats in the diagram, and the description right after it:
"I used a closed top barrel, put upside down so I could use the 3/4 threaded fitting, then cut off the bottom (now top.) Note that I tilt the barrel towards the output so that any water on the bottom gets sent into the CF. If you don't suck from the lowest point, there could be a pocket of water that settles out and keeps re-contaminating the dewatered VO. A cone bottom tank would be the best, but this was a lot cheaper. Here is a good way to test if you have a good barrel drain and tilt, pour an inch of water in the bottom and see if it all runs out the drain pipe. The suction should come from the lowest point, and the pipe should go continuously lower until the pump. Otherwise you could get a pocket of water in your pipes."
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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Re: pickup

Postby coachgeo » Mon Apr 28, 2008 12:08 pm

SunWizard wrote:.... The suction should come from the lowest point, and the pipe should go continuously lower until the pump. Otherwise you could get a pocket of water in your pipes."
Not understanding the end of that sentence. Probably need a mental picture for it to make since but Im drawing a blank instead.
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