Can a DB2 be rebuilt?

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Can a DB2 be rebuilt?

Postby Performance Plus WVO » Tue May 20, 2008 9:34 pm

Can a DB2 be rebuilt by a common person with mediocre mechanical skills without a test bench? What is the most common wear item inside it? How much does a test bench cost ? Could I build one? Thanks in advance.
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Postby rkpatt » Wed May 21, 2008 7:47 am

I have seen few posts on the 6.2 forums at www.dieselplace.com www.oilburners.net and http://www.smokstak.com/ on rebuilding these DB2 pumps . Based on what I have read , it is almost impossible to do a good without a test bench ( which cost thousands $ ) .

Here is one of those threads on this subject -

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showth ... b2+rebuild


However , I am very interested in seeing how these pumps function and will soon be dissecting a no core value dead DB2 pump from a 4 cyl industrial engine given to me by a friend .

Please post any other information that you find .

- Thanks
Last edited by rkpatt on Thu May 22, 2008 6:47 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Postby Radrick » Wed May 21, 2008 1:08 pm

rkpatt wrote:I have seen few posts on the 6.2 forums at www.dieselplace.com and http://www.smokstak.com/ on rebuilding these DB2 pumps . Based on what I have read , it is almost impossible to good job to do without a test bench ( which cost thousands $ ) .

However , I am very interested in seeing how these pumps function and will soon be dissecting a no core value dead DB2 pump from a 4 cyl industrial engine given to me by friend .

Please post any other information that you find .

- Thanks


I to am very curious about the inner working. I have a DB4 off my chevy 6.5, I purchased a rebuilt pump that did not require a core. I am hoping to find time to tear into it in the next couple of weeks. I am a member of the dieselplace. The venders on that sit are very good, I bought mine from Tim @ Accurate Diesel. I believe he has the DB2's as well. His price was within 20% of the cheapest I could find on ebay and who knows what I would have gotten from there.
1995 Chevy K1500 6.5 TD not on WVO yet but soon.
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Postby rkpatt » Wed May 21, 2008 1:35 pm

Radrick - Great - Please take pictures and upload them to an album at someplace like photobucket or webshots . I will do the same when I get that DB2 apart .

I have seen references to free (public domain ) military repair manuals for the Stanadyne DB2 and DS4 IPs but have been unsuccessful in finding them for download . edit - here it is - many thanks to the person ( zacnurnberger) who uploaded it - http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showth ... p?t=228199 . The IP is in section 2 .

BTW- How much was the core charge form Accurate Diesel ?

Thanks
Last edited by rkpatt on Fri May 23, 2008 5:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby VegMeister » Fri May 23, 2008 1:21 am

Radrick:

Unless you've rebuilt many DBs in the past (under the supervision of some experts, while working as an apprentice) I wouldn't recommend tackling a rebuild.

Even guys who have done them a lot will tell you, you're WAY WAY better off getting a rebuilt one. Talk with the guys at Valley Diesel (Fox Valley, WI) about getting one of their "improved rebuilds."

They claim to have solved the warm start problem (which you should start getting in June, if you don't have it already) and several other improvements. If you try a rebuild yourself, not only are you going to miss those but you're also having a BIG risk of not getting it right.

disclaimer: I'm not at all affiliated with Valley Diesel except that I'll be one of their customers (as soon as I can get my shot DB taken off... my truck's been smoking for the last 500 miles or so, don't know whether to blame veg oil or not).
centralvalleybiodiesel CF
1993 GMC Sierra K2500 6.5L + homebuilt veg kit, OEM glowplug failure (update: rebuilt with a 6.2 block, working fine)
1988 Ford 6.9L OEM dual tank, 90+% veg oil blend.
1989 Ford 7.3L, 80+% veg oil blend.
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Postby BMW Fan » Fri May 23, 2008 5:48 am

... my truck's been smoking for the last 500 miles or so, don't know whether to blame veg oil or not).


Why do you believe that your injector pump needs a rebuilt if your engine is smoking ?
More likely you got dripping injectors or your timing is incorrect.....or your filters are blocked.


BMW Fan

http://www.crawldog.com/klausold/
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Postby VegMeister » Fri May 23, 2008 5:17 pm

Yes, I probably have a dripping injector as well. Which is why I'm getting fuel oil in my engine. I thought about that since I posted, but not before you replied. Thankfully injectors are only 40$ a pop at my diesel injection shop.

But I'm still going to get a new IP, if the rebuild that they have fixes the warm start issue. That is the MOST annoying problem in the world, it's a show stopper (call your friend and ask for a ride), and it can only be solved with new internal parts on the IP.
centralvalleybiodiesel CF
1993 GMC Sierra K2500 6.5L + homebuilt veg kit, OEM glowplug failure (update: rebuilt with a 6.2 block, working fine)
1988 Ford 6.9L OEM dual tank, 90+% veg oil blend.
1989 Ford 7.3L, 80+% veg oil blend.
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Postby BMW Fan » Fri May 23, 2008 5:55 pm

"Which is why I'm getting fuel oil in my engine. .


Is it your believe that new injectors and a rebuilt IP will solve these problem :o

BMW Fan

http://www.crawldog.com/klausold/
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Postby VegMeister » Fri May 23, 2008 9:25 pm

Yes I believe that if I don't have a cracked head (which I can determine with a compression test) then I should be able to solve the problem with replaced IP and injectors.
centralvalleybiodiesel CF
1993 GMC Sierra K2500 6.5L + homebuilt veg kit, OEM glowplug failure (update: rebuilt with a 6.2 block, working fine)
1988 Ford 6.9L OEM dual tank, 90+% veg oil blend.
1989 Ford 7.3L, 80+% veg oil blend.
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Location: Pembine, WI

Postby BMW Fan » Sat May 24, 2008 4:57 am

VegMeister,

don't you think that you must have worn or sticking piston rings if unburned fuel mixes into your engine oil ?
If you have a cracked head it would mix into the coolant.

BMW Fan

http://www.crawldog.com/klausold/
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Postby Radrick » Wed May 28, 2008 12:41 pm

VegMeister wrote:Radrick:

Unless you've rebuilt many DBs in the past (under the supervision of some experts, while working as an apprentice) I wouldn't recommend tackling a rebuild.

Even guys who have done them a lot will tell you, you're WAY WAY better off getting a rebuilt one. Talk with the guys at Valley Diesel (Fox Valley, WI) about getting one of their "improved rebuilds."

They claim to have solved the warm start problem (which you should start getting in June, if you don't have it already) and several other improvements. If you try a rebuild yourself, not only are you going to miss those but you're also having a BIG risk of not getting it right.

disclaimer: I'm not at all affiliated with Valley Diesel except that I'll be one of their customers (as soon as I can get my shot DB taken off... my truck's been smoking for the last 500 miles or so, don't know whether to blame veg oil or not).


Hey Vegmeister
How is your truck doing on the wvo? I think you may have misread my post. I already have a rebuilt IP installed on my truck and it is running great. I bought a "rebuilt" D-Tech IP that did not require a core so now I have my old IP sitting on my garage bench. I am planning on tearing it appart just to see how it is built. I will most likly then throw the hole thing in the garbage unless I find a few items that can be used for some other use.
1995 Chevy K1500 6.5 TD not on WVO yet but soon.
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Postby Radrick » Wed May 28, 2008 12:47 pm

VegMeister wrote:Yes I believe that if I don't have a cracked head (which I can determine with a compression test) then I should be able to solve the problem with replaced IP and injectors.


A compression test will not be a reliable test for a cracked head. Most engines with a crack in the combustion chamber only leak after warm up or during the transition. If you have a crack that is leaking you will have pressure in your cooling system. Usually this will cause your upper radiator hose to feel hard. You will also see a loose of anti freeze since there will be ocations when you shut off the engine when the crack is open and leaking and the coolant will drip into the cylinder. I suspect that if you do have a leaking crack that this is the most likly cause of your hard starting when warm. I have a 6.5td now and I used to have a 6.2, I have not experianced any issue with starting it when warm. I guess I am not familiar with this problem. Is it confined to the manual IP? Are you familiar with the Dieselplace web site? They have a wealth of info on the gm diesels.
1995 Chevy K1500 6.5 TD not on WVO yet but soon.
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Postby VegMeister » Wed May 28, 2008 2:05 pm

Where did you get the IP from? Did they say they had the warm start fix built into it? All DB pumps have this problem, on tractors, 6.2s and everything. Ask any injection shop and they'll tell you what the problem is and how they can fix it with a new IP. Basically there's no fuel going through the upper part of the pump, unfortunately this means that it does not want to start (with no fuel). A regular rebuilt IP will cost 325$ (average, can get it cheaper here locally). One with the fix will be a minumum of 700$ but after last summer's experience it is WELL worth the money because it only crops up at the worst times ("I'll just stop at the bank for 15 minutes" but 15 minutes turns into 20 minutes or whatever the magic number is and then you're stuck until the whole thing cools down).

I can't wait to save up the money for a fixed IP. Do some reading on the DB and the DB2, great pump but the weirdest of weird when it comes to problems. Also, did you get a biodiesel compat. rebuild? Where did you get it? What price? Why didn't they have a core charge? The cheapest I can get an IP with all the things I want with no core charge is 1100$, but probably worth it. With core you can get it down to as low as 225$ but that's not going to have biodiesel seals or the re-drilled (for the problem) components.
centralvalleybiodiesel CF
1993 GMC Sierra K2500 6.5L + homebuilt veg kit, OEM glowplug failure (update: rebuilt with a 6.2 block, working fine)
1988 Ford 6.9L OEM dual tank, 90+% veg oil blend.
1989 Ford 7.3L, 80+% veg oil blend.
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Joined: Sat Mar 08, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Pembine, WI

Postby Radrick » Thu May 29, 2008 5:01 pm

VegMeister wrote:Where did you get the IP from? Did they say they had the warm start fix built into it? All DB pumps have this problem, on tractors, 6.2s and everything. Ask any injection shop and they'll tell you what the problem is and how they can fix it with a new IP. Basically there's no fuel going through the upper part of the pump, unfortunately this means that it does not want to start (with no fuel). A regular rebuilt IP will cost 325$ (average, can get it cheaper here locally). One with the fix will be a minumum of 700$ but after last summer's experience it is WELL worth the money because it only crops up at the worst times ("I'll just stop at the bank for 15 minutes" but 15 minutes turns into 20 minutes or whatever the magic number is and then you're stuck until the whole thing cools down).

I can't wait to save up the money for a fixed IP. Do some reading on the DB and the DB2, great pump but the weirdest of weird when it comes to problems. Also, did you get a biodiesel compat. rebuild? Where did you get it? What price? Why didn't they have a core charge? The cheapest I can get an IP with all the things I want with no core charge is 1100$, but probably worth it. With core you can get it down to as low as 225$ but that's not going to have biodiesel seals or the re-drilled (for the problem) components.


Veg
I bought my IP from Accurate Diesel. Tim is the owner and he is a standup guy. I paid $800 for a DB4 IP with a new PMD on it. This would normally cost $1500 from any one else since the PMD alone is $350. He has several choices in the DB4 pumps, I didn't look at his DB2 pumps. My truck has alway started so fast when warm that you can't even tell the starter engaged. The best place for tech info that I have found for the Chevy diesels is a forum called dieselplace you can find any and all info there on every possible issue with the 6.2 or 6.5 including the fuel system. Tim is a site vender for that forum and I only purchase from site venders if it is at all possible since that site has saved me countless dollars and headaches. There are also many members on the DP forum that are running wvo with many different types of systems from complete kits to home made systems, many of them have been running wvo for a long time and have tens of thousands of miles on wvo.
1995 Chevy K1500 6.5 TD not on WVO yet but soon.
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