98 Dodge 12 valve conversion help with design

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98 Dodge 12 valve conversion help with design

Postby 123eddie » Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:44 am

What do you think about this design. Small tank in bed like Sunwizards but used for diesel and the stock 35 gallon tank used for wvo. Possible FASS fuel system with filters from Roverhybrids or heated filter and FPHE from BMWfan. I live in southern CA and the truck will likely vacation where it is also warm so I'm thinking I don't need HIH or HOH. Even though this truck has a great lift pump I thinking about using an aux. fuel pump to keep keep the systems separate. Preferences on switching valves would be appricated. I think that Sunwizard has it right with the manual. I promise to post pictures of build and use your combined experience. I have been running wvo in mercede since december 2007 and with all my research I now can claim to have 5 yrs experience and probably another 5 by next post. At the end of this install who knows maybe 20 years experience. Seriously with the information and talent given so freely on this site one could claim to have 100 yrs experiance.
Thanks
123eddie
 
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Postby SunWizard » Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:42 pm

Heated pickup and lines is worth it since you can run PHO which is much easier to find. Without it even in S. CA I wouldn't run PHO. Consider running VO on the stock lift pump and D2 with an add-on, since nothing comes close to the strength and reliability of the stock pump. Also you can't deadhead the stock pump.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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Postby 123eddie » Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:21 pm

Hi Sunwizard thanks for the reply. I have no idea what dead head is ? Your statement on heated lines and pickup makes sense. What do you think about the stock tank as wvo and a tank similar to yours for the diesel. thanks
123eddie
 
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Postby SunWizard » Wed Jun 11, 2008 10:14 pm

123eddie wrote:Hi Sunwizard thanks for the reply. I have no idea what dead head is ?

It means blocking the output of the pump by turning a valve. You need to learn what it is for your conversion if you go with a 2nd pump.
What do you think about the stock tank as wvo and a tank similar to yours for the diesel. thanks

That would work, but doing a good heated pickup in the stock plastic tank is much harder to do than my VO tank was, since you have to either pull the tank or the bed off the truck.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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Postby 123eddie » Fri Jun 13, 2008 9:00 am

Ok SunWizard I found a tank that goes across the bed thank holds 45 gallons and rated as a aux tank for and made in Ca. It measures 60" wide 19" tall and 11" deep. My goal is to be able to go at least 800 miles on wvo and your statement about ease of conversion vs stock tank makes sense.

I think I'm begining to understand dead head. The return loop would need to have a switching valve installed in order to return diesel to diesel tank and veg to veg tank.

The only reason I was thinking about using an electric fuel pump in the first place is because Shane form Roverhybrids came up with this system to correct the problems that the later Dodges that have in a weak lift pump. He mounts the pump and filter forward of the rear wheel in the generous wheel well and then runs to switching valve @ injector pump with ck valves and a FPHE right before the I.P. I like the looks of this system because of yours and others have convinced me that pushing oil is better than using vaccum. The Dodge is very crowded under the hood and this would keep the some of the hard to place items out of the way and make it easier to change the veg fuel filter. I really like Rover's kit but my budget at the moment will not let me go there. If I go with the FASS fuel system I will buy it from Roverhybrids. Also he uses electric switching valves and I plan to stick with your manual version. On one of the sites people were talking about cable controls and someone chimed in with these cool aircraft controls that were reasonable priced.

The other thing I'm planning to do is use hydralic hose and fittings in place of barbs and clamps. I have a friend that will help with this install and he has the shop and equipment to make any hose needed.

Thanks again
123eddie
 
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Postby roverhybrids » Mon Jun 16, 2008 9:12 pm

Eddie,
My suggestion for you would be to stick close to Sun's setup.

personally what I would do different from Sun is use electric valves(2 supply and one return) and an 200w electric filter wrap around a fleetguard fs1000 filter.

For a budget tank heat I would use 5/8" ID alum tube and put a coil or two in the tank around the pickup(again like Sun only different size I think)
You need the tube in hose to go from the tank to the engine compartment to ge the VO over 120F before the filter. I use 1/2" OD alum in 1" heat hose.

Then a 30 plate final heat exchanger.

I like the electric valves cause it makes for simple use rather than trying to explain and remember how to operate 3 manual levers as well as placement for one switch vs 3 levers which generally have to be in the floor since they are connected to the fuel lines. A single switch can control the system with electric.

And yes I understand the benefits of manual valves, it comes down to a personal choice.

As far as the FASS system. I am a big fan of the FASS, that is why I designed my system around it; but with your vehicle it is hard to justify the extra $700 you would need to spend to utilize it.
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Postby 123eddie » Tue Jun 17, 2008 7:55 am

Thanks for your reply Shane. I appreciate yours and Sun's input. I'm at least two months from converting and I want to do it right. After being on most of the forums I was not interested in posting and being the next new kid on the block to pick on, so I just keep reading. Then all the people posting on the other sites that I felt were knowledgeable and helpful showed up here. Thank you Sun and Coach and others who made this possible. I was trying to do the (don't live in Alaska) conversion and I'm starting to feel that it is just as easy to do it right with HIH. I still like Rovers filters in the wheel well but you guys have convinced me of two things. One it is not necessary with my lift pump. Two push thru filters instead of pull. So this leads me to start looking for space under hood for filter after lift pump. I was leaning towards manual valves but I will now research the benefits of both. If I'm on track here, the manual valves are more reliable but can take up more space to install and also are more confusing to use. The only other person that would occasionally drive the truck would be my wife and yes there is now way that you could get her to switch valves.
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96 Dodge install

Postby Grease Student » Sun Jun 22, 2008 1:23 pm

Hi Eddie. Dave Roberson here.

I have converted several 94-98 12 valve Dodges. I would be happy to help you. Mine work GREAT. Although after installing a Rover Hybrids kit in a 07 Dodge I am upgrading to 30 plate heat exchangers and much more insulation. (Thanks Shane for the BEST common rail Dodge Kit I have ever seen or installed)

I have a Hot Fox heated tank...Veggie oil electric pump by the makers of FASS...3 valves...One recirulates diesel back to diesel return when on Veggie. Full return to veg tank on veggie (I HATE air bubbles in loops). 30 plate heat exchanger. Fuel temp and pressure gauges.

I have designed my own Heated filter bracket that replaces the passengers side battery hold down and a bracket for the heat exchanger and switching valves. I have made fittings to deal with the injector return fitting without cutting off the banjo fitting.i hate cutting fuel fittings off)

I used a 45 PSI DieselPerformance Products pump although now I am using the adjustable pressure pump they offer for veggie. I get 165 to 175 degree oil when my coolant is 190.

Check out the install photos on www.veggiegarage.com I am having about 5 more installs posted in the next few days including a 96 Dodge I did a few weeks ago.

Send me your email thru my website and I can send you some zipped files full of photos.

If you are going to be in Phoenix before you do your install please drop by and I can walk you around my install and even let you drive it around to see how smooth it is.

Hope I can help,Dave
95 Dodge Ram...2 Tank...Veggiegarage.com
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Postby 123eddie » Sun Jun 22, 2008 11:23 pm

Hi Dave I went to your web site and your installs look very clean. I plan on installing my conversion although your $50 per shop hr install sounds tempting. I like the bracket you made up for the fphe and the valves. I haven't made my mind up yet on whether to go with electric or manual. I really like the reliability of manual but the electric appear to be easier to install and for the ocassional drive by my wife.
123eddie
 
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Postby 123eddie » Fri Jul 11, 2008 8:22 am

I bought my tank yesterday. I originally wanted to use the stock tank for wvo but after Sun's comment on ease of running wvo is an separate tank, I bought a 45 gallon aluminum tank that goes across the bed and is 10 inches wide. I really wanted to keep my full bed length but the desire to leave my home and drive 900 miles lead me to this tank. This is the tank I went with http://aerotanks.com/veh/diamondplates.htm for $595 without tax. Now that this decision is done it is on to filters, HPHE, HOH or HIH and the one that I 'm having the most trouble with manual valves or electric. Any help on the next decisions will be appreciated.
123eddie
 
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Postby 123eddie » Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:56 am

I can't believe how long it's been since I last posted. I have made considerable progress and should be running on wvo soon. I bought all of my components form Shane at RoverHybrids and I am extremely satisfied with his design, installation tips, price and quick shipping with Fed Ex and tracking number and he only bills your credit card the day it ships. The one major difference between my conversion and Suns is I went with Hydraforce valves. When my wife's car was down and she drove my truck for a month it became obvious that making it as automatic as possible was necessary. I originally planned on mounting the 30 plate FPHE on the driver's side firewall but now that I am close to plumbing everything in, the two hard pipe coolant lines over the exhaust manifold looks like the perfict place for the FPHE with less plumbing involved. Any thoughts?
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