Electric (vegtherm or other) versus coolant heat FPHE

For discussing the modifications needed for diesel vehicles to run with 2 tank veggie oil conversions.

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Postby Welder » Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:48 am

Hi Burb.

Yeah, I might be able to run a CF off the Frankenpump, but instead of my racing regulator, I'd need to rig up a relief valve that cracks at 90 PSI.
"Is there anybody out there?"

Roger Waters
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Postby FlyboyDVIII » Thu Mar 20, 2008 5:15 am

Burbarian wrote:
FlyboyDVIII wrote:One of the Veg vendors sells a coolant heated aluminum block that bolts to the Base of the FASS. Me, I have one of my coolant to tank heater hoses sandwiched between the head of my Fass and the Tank, "Woodchuck Engineering" at it's finest! :D :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


Would you care to do a review and share your experiences using the Fass? It would be of great value to collate a listing of hardware and best principles in undertaking a veg conversion.

All of my veg fuel pumps that failed or failed to move veg, were also wraped or in direct contact with coolant heated Hoses. They still failed or failed to perform.


What make/model were these and what were the conditions and failure modes? Of equal value is a list of hardware that DOES NOT perform adequately, so that forum members just starting out can avoid them.

My Veg filter head (HotHead) is a 2" thick aluminum Block that is coolant heated, it is in the same orientation as the Veg Max. Filter is above the heated head. Heat rises, keeps filter HOT! The tractors we finish converting this summer will have our version of the same style head w/ 1-12 thread to use the Sym-Tec line of filters on.


What model number of Sym-tec filters? Filters that can withstand continuous high heat under pressure without deformation and delamination would be absolutely vital in a well engineered conversion. Thanks in advance, the collaborative sharing of information is the backbone of progress.


Burbarian:

You have permission to do a search on the infopop site of my posts and copy and past the relevant info here, within the last 30 days I have listed all of the above asked for items on the other site. Including my thoughts on the FASS,(pure Joy and Happiness). it is a great idea. Today is the first day of spring, and I just don't have the time to do so myself. I will check your progress and send you PM's to assist as I can.
I do keep a log in my truck. Every filter, and any change to my truck I have documented since 11-06, I wish I had done so since 5-06 when converted.


Look to SunWizard"s truck summary for the info on the fuel filters
93, F250, 7.3, N/A, WVO since 5-06 over 147K so far, 2wd, ext cab, 100 gal. tank, DIY system. 10psi 23A FASS w/ ProComp regulator.

FilterFuge FF60 CF, over 22,300 gal. spun
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Postby Radrick » Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:00 pm

John Galt wrote:The calcs I did for FPHEs showed the same conclusion. A 12 to 16 plate FPHE rated at 85kBTU/hr puts out as much heat as a medium size house furnace; quite adequate for the job. More is not necessarily better, and an over sized FPHE can actually slow the warm-up time. It's like the faulty logic that thinks turning the room thermostat to maximum warms the room up any faster.

There's no point risking dollars of possible engine damage to maybe save a few cents of diesel.


Ok I am getting ready to purchase my fphe and I am trying to decide what size. Correct me if I am wrong but i will need to have my fuel temp at around 40f in order to pump it up to the fphe so the fact that i am in frigid MN doesn't really affect my fphe. With a starting temp of 40f min. and a output of 200f max I would have a delta T of 160f. I don't know what my gpm is at the fphe and I don't know what the density of wvo is compared to water. Does anyone have this info or has anyone done the calcs on this to determine the correct size fphe? I am guessing that 10 or 16 is plenty so why use a bigger one when space and money are both at a premium?
1995 Chevy K1500 6.5 TD not on WVO yet but soon.
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Postby SunWizard » Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:35 pm

Any from 16 to 26 would be good for your truck.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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Postby Radrick » Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:50 pm

SunWizard wrote:Any from 16 to 26 would be good for your truck.


Sun. Do you know how much difference there is in volume in a 20 verses a 16 plate? Also do you or does anyone know what the gpm flow rate of the diesel is on my truck? I am planing on adding a second stock electric transfer pump for the wvo. I would like to get a rough idea how long the purge is going to take. I really like the BMW fans fittings but I don't want to lengthen my switchover or purge times as I do a lot of in town errands during the day for my job.
Sun. When you are running around in town say 2 miles do you switch over to wvo or do you just run the trip on the heated dino. You do have your dino running thru your fphe if i remember correctly, right? I will need to with my rotary ip. Also I have what is called an ambulance idle option were I can run my truck on high idle. Is it ok to idle it at a convieniance store for example if it is running at 1070rpm? just thinking about how this is going to work out for me. :wink:
1995 Chevy K1500 6.5 TD not on WVO yet but soon.
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Postby SunWizard » Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:13 pm

Volume difference 16 to 20 would be <25%. If your rig is looped, the flow is 0.1gpm. Not looped, around 1gpm. Depends on RPM and load. Purge is very quick if you plumb it right, <1 minute no matter what FPHE.

Short trips <5 miles, no VO unless the engine is already warmed up. Coolant temps is the way I decide, only switch when its above 160F. If I am stopping for 15 mins or less I stay on VO. Stanadyne IPs may need to cut that time depending on ambient temp. No heated diesel on mine.

Idling on D2 or VO is a bad idea. I don't know how much the 1070rpms helps with that problem since you are still at no load, and constant speed.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
SunWizard
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