Gear pump pressure ?

Collecting, filtering and dewatering of WVO SVO vegetable oil. For Biodiesel producers too.

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Gear pump pressure ?

Postby gary » Tue Oct 28, 2008 4:40 pm

When my oil gets over the 180 mark my pressure drops off (with the by pass off) from 80(my max) to 65psi...is this still effective and what can I do to get my pressure up..larger motor?
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Postby SunWizard » Tue Oct 28, 2008 6:19 pm

Don't go over 160F works the best. Temps above that make little difference in filter/dewater, and can damage your pump and cause poly in your VO. And 65psi will be much less effective for filtering.
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temp

Postby gary » Tue Oct 28, 2008 6:52 pm

What is the best way to measure the temps...Im dipping a portabe probe. Should I put a tee in line with a nipple and a guage?
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Re: temp

Postby newtoveggie » Sun Nov 02, 2008 6:02 pm

gary wrote:What is the best way to measure the temps...Im dipping a portabe probe. Should I put a tee in line with a nipple and a guage?


I would definitely put a nipple and a gauge to make life easier.

I have the same problem but it happens at 130 degrees. Pressure drops down to 60 PSI from 80 PSI as temps climb. I have ran at least 6 - 6 hour sessions and all the previous ones were capable of higher pressures. Do these gear pumps wear out that quick? Dayton 6NY-91.
Last week I ran a batch of really bad oil. I would actually call it water it was so bad. Steam was pouring out of the top of the barrel and I let it run. The CF cover is now black which I attribute to lack of oil to cool it.

I am not sure how to proceed from here. Does this sound like a bad CF or bad gear pump? Should I repair the packing?
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Postby SunWizard » Sun Nov 02, 2008 8:26 pm

A black CF cover would be due to acid in the VO. This could also have damaged your gear pump. No they don't wear out with normal use, I have run mine for 1000s of gallons and it hasn't changed a bit. And my gear pump was very old and used when I got it.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
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Postby newtoveggie » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:15 am

Let me clarify:

The black is on the top/outside (dry side) of the CF (under the cover of course-which is already black). Would this still be due to Acid? Sad - my CF is no longer shiny and new.

Acid? What would that be from?

Can I repair packing or something like that to avoid another $174.00 purchase?

The batch was cream colored and loose (consistency of water). My gut said it was crap but my desire for oil overcame that. Silly.


SunWizard wrote:A black CF cover would be due to acid in the VO. This could also have damaged your gear pump. No they don't wear out with normal use, I have run mine for 1000s of gallons and it hasn't changed a bit. And my gear pump was very old and used when I got it.
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Postby SunWizard » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:53 am

Acids are created in the poly process, see the poly thread. A black CF cover has no effect on how it operates.

Your lower pressure could have been due to the large amount of water making it too thin. Run some more normal VO and see if the pressure is better.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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Postby newtoveggie » Mon Nov 03, 2008 11:23 am

I tried some great quality oil yesterday and still only achieved 65 PSI with the bypass closed 100%. Temp was 130 degrees when I stopped because pressure dropped as temps climbed. The prime is gone as well.


SunWizard wrote:Acids are created in the poly process, see the poly thread. A black CF cover has no effect on how it operates.

Your lower pressure could have been due to the large amount of water making it too thin. Run some more normal VO and see if the pressure is better.
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Postby coachgeo » Mon Nov 03, 2008 11:51 am

acids from what I have read can come from other sources too such as cleaners used to clean the fryer out. These can get dumped into the drum along with the fryer wash water and last of the wvo from that day.

Dana Linscott talks often of water soluble acids that can be in the water. Im not sure all the sources for the acids he speaks of nor how strong the acids can get.

All I can think of is check your Orings to see if they got mauled by anything like the acid we are discussing
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Postby newtoveggie » Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:05 pm

I don't believe they use a cleaner for the oil. They do have a mechanical cleaner but I don't think they add anything to it. Are there Orings in a gear pump? I know the packing is Kevlar. Grainger Dayton Gear Pump 6NY-91

coachgeo wrote:acids from what I have read can come from other sources too such as cleaners used to clean the fryer out. These can get dumped into the drum along with the fryer wash water and last of the wvo from that day.

Dana Linscott talks often of water soluble acids that can be in the water. Im not sure all the sources for the acids he speaks of nor how strong the acids can get.

All I can think of is check your Orings to see if they got mauled by anything like the acid we are discussing
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Postby newtoveggie » Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:59 pm

As an update I wanted to let you know where I was with this problem. I talked to John (dieselcraft) and he thinks there is something wrong with the CF. It is not holding pressure. I will try another rotor and let you all know how it goes.

newtoveggie wrote:I don't believe they use a cleaner for the oil. They do have a mechanical cleaner but I don't think they add anything to it. Are there Orings in a gear pump? I know the packing is Kevlar. Grainger Dayton Gear Pump 6NY-91

coachgeo wrote:acids from what I have read can come from other sources too such as cleaners used to clean the fryer out. These can get dumped into the drum along with the fryer wash water and last of the wvo from that day.

Dana Linscott talks often of water soluble acids that can be in the water. Im not sure all the sources for the acids he speaks of nor how strong the acids can get.

All I can think of is check your Orings to see if they got mauled by anything like the acid we are discussing
newtoveggie
 
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Joined: Fri May 09, 2008 11:07 pm
Location: Andover, MA

Postby coachgeo » Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:25 pm

newtoveggie wrote:I don't believe they use a cleaner for the oil. ...
cleaner is not for the oil. It is for the once every 4 or six weeks they clean the "fryer".

Think oven cleaner
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Postby newtoveggie » Thu Nov 06, 2008 5:05 pm

What is in the cleaner? Anything that can hurt a pump or CF?



coachgeo wrote:
newtoveggie wrote:I don't believe they use a cleaner for the oil. ...
cleaner is not for the oil. It is for the once every 4 or six weeks they clean the "fryer".

Think oven cleaner
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Postby SunWizard » Thu Nov 06, 2008 5:27 pm

Most cleaners are bases like lye (potassium hydroxide). Yes they can hurt a pump, but probably not hurt the CF other than making it black.

Your temps you mentioned of >180F can damage most pumps.

The most likely problem is that pump is too small. Its best to have one that always exceeds the flow you need and bypass the excess.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
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Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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Postby newtoveggie » Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:08 pm

UPDATE

I received a new rotor and while installing it I noticed that the spindle had gouges on it where the bushings sit. I am attributing these grooves in the spindle to the amount of water that ran through the system and the lack of lubricant it supplied.
I will await the new base to arrive and keep you updated.
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