brass or steel

For discussing the modifications needed for diesel vehicles to run with 2 tank veggie oil conversions.

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brass or steel

Postby gary » Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:23 am

People are reporting that brass is reactive with vo as well now. So is it more or less than steel...when gathering parts for my 12 valve conversion what type of metal should be favored?
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Postby SunWizard » Thu Jul 09, 2009 11:23 am

Both are bad in your tank, and easy to avoid. Anyplace else there isn't enough air and time for it to be a problem, since those are the main factors for poly to form.
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Postby dragonfly » Thu Jul 23, 2009 9:57 am

I recently broke down a few of the brass 90's on the FPHE. I have rather clean filtered VO as demonstrated by the long intervals of a year or better before a filter change. I found a sizable amount of "junk" in the connectors. Since then, I'm very interested in replacing the brass to aluminum connectors. IMHO
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Postby John Galt » Thu Jul 23, 2009 2:33 pm

What sort of 'junk', what color? How dry is the VO ?
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Postby dragonfly » Sat Jul 25, 2009 12:46 am

Hard to describe the "junk". Brown color substance build up at the corners of the 90's. The oil is tested using the Sandy Brea Water Testing system: Raw oil was at 675 ppm and CF'd oil at 120F, 1/2 gal/min tested 75 ppm. I change out the VO filter once a year after approximately 10K miles even if the filter is still passing oil and not plugged.
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Postby John Galt » Sat Jul 25, 2009 4:35 am

The description sounds like polymerized VO. Is it on both inlet and outlet fittings of the FPHE?

Aluminum is more reactive than brass. If you feel the problem is the choice of metals then use steel.
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Postby VegMeister » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:00 am

John,

aluminium is more reactive than steel? On what do you base that? I've had minor problems with steel drums causing polymerization, but zero problems with my 120gal tidy tank (in the bed of my truck).

From my limited experience I have found aluminium to be less reactive than steel.
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1993 GMC Sierra K2500 6.5L + homebuilt veg kit, OEM glowplug failure (update: rebuilt with a 6.2 block, working fine)
1988 Ford 6.9L OEM dual tank, 90+% veg oil blend.
1989 Ford 7.3L, 80+% veg oil blend.
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Postby SunWizard » Sun Jul 26, 2009 9:39 am

Steel is more reactive to VO than aluminum. Here is the order from most to least reactive with vegetable oil: Copper, Brass, Iron, Mild steel, zinc (galvanized), Stainless steel, Aluminum. In addition, vegetable oil polymers bond to mild steel forming a "chicken skin", which adds to the oxidative polymerization in fuel tanks
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
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Postby John Galt » Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:33 pm

It depends a lot on the presence of oxygen, water and salts, especially when dissimilar metals are in contact. Clear clean dry VO reacts differently than dirty wet "WVO". V100 reacts differently than VO-ULSD blends. Generalizations can be misleading, details make all the difference in the world.
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Postby SunWizard » Sun Jul 26, 2009 4:28 pm

John Galt wrote:It depends a lot on the presence of oxygen, water and salts, especially when dissimilar metals are in contact. Clear clean dry VO reacts differently than dirty wet "WVO". V100 reacts differently than VO-ULSD blends. Generalizations can be misleading, details make all the difference in the world.

As I said above, air, time and temp are the main ingredients for poly, so not much to worry about metal type except in your tank. There should never be enough water or salt to cause poly or corrosion problems if you do hot pan tests. If there is too much water you will have much worse problems with your IP and injectors than the issues of poly or what your tube and connectors are made of.

Dissimilar metals in contact is a whole different issue (galvanic corrosion), but not a problem I have heard of to cause VO poly. Again you would have to have a huge amount of water for that to become an issue, and your engine would be ruined from the water itself before metal reactivity would be an issue.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
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