storage and filtering

Collecting, filtering and dewatering of WVO SVO vegetable oil. For Biodiesel producers too.

Moderators: SunWizard, coachgeo

storage and filtering

Postby JR3342 » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:01 pm

Quick background. On this
oil won't pass hpt it Verry humid here tried cold upflow, heat and settle, frybrid still. No change in bubbles as its gotton hotter its getting more bubbles.
So I have ordered pa biodiesel cf. If this don't work im out of ideas.
Now the question is I have 300 gal sitting in barrels. Do I keep it seperated or store it all together in ibc? Some is in barrels of rock salt and bs that didn't dewater it either but killed the puke stink. Its from 5 diffrent places.
Do I mist wash and put in 1 tote till I cf it as needed?
Cf it all and fill the tote?
Any input is welcome on how to deal with this in hot humid sc. Coast.
Also wont pass hpt on the day I get it. But it did in cooler weather months.
Last edited by JR3342 on Fri Jul 15, 2011 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
JR3342
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 2:46 pm

Postby John Galt » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:24 pm

Also wont pass hpt on the day I get it. But it did in cooler months.


That's likely because the PHO and fats which are holding the water will solidify and settle out in temperatures below 50°F. Centrifuging the warm UVO probably won't separate it out, but maybe it will. I have no experience with centrifuges. Chill the UVO and pump the clear UVO off the top, it will likely pass.
John Galt
 
Posts: 526
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2008 9:17 pm
Location: Coldest North America

Postby JR3342 » Fri Jul 15, 2011 6:32 pm

Wont be gettin it cold for a few months. Its in the dark 95% of the time but with summer weather shed is around 120 deg inside all day. Oil stays at 80-85 deg on its own. As far as pho goes only 1 place uses creamy mix but haven't pu there in a while due to there barrel has major bacteria growing in this heat. Rest use canola soy and veg.
im not overly knowledgeable about vo. Will it pull in moisture from the air everytime I open the barrels? Which makes me wonder if the dry oil in tank will become wet quickly? Wich would lead to the question is hpt pointless in humid climate? Working on putting a desiccant breather onto the gc tank.
JR3342
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 2:46 pm

Re: storage and filtering

Postby SunWizard » Fri Jul 15, 2011 8:31 pm

JR3342 wrote:Quick background. On this
oil won't pass hpt it Verry humid here tried cold upflow, heat and settle, frybrid still. No change in bubbles as its gotton hotter its getting more bubbles.
So I have ordered pa biodiesel cf. If this don't work im out of ideas.
Now the question is I have 300 gal sitting in barrels. Do I keep it seperated or store it all together in ibc?

Separated is best since you can keep it with the least air. Are the barrels sealed tight from air? Its very common that settling methods don't work with some old stinky WVO, or if its high FFA. Try to keep it cool since the higher the temp, the faster it goes bad.
Some is in barrels of rock salt and bs that didn't dewater it either but killed the puke stink. Its from 5 diffrent places.
Do I mist wash and put in 1 tote till I cf it as needed?

When I am going to CF, I don't mist wash, see the dieselcraft thread here for details.
Cf it all and fill the tote?

Yes CF it as soon as you can since the stink could be food and meat particles going bad, which degrades the WVO. Its probably high FFA which is the main thing that holds onto water, see the thread here about FFA, testing FFA is very easy with test strips. I have found in lots of testing (with 3 different water tests) that PHO doesn't hold onto water (unless its cold and solidified). high FFA and animal fats do.
YVORMV - Your veg. oil results may vary.
95 Dodge Cummins 4x4 SVO WVO conversion.
81 Mercedes 300D- stock and happy on V80/D20 blend.
Low fossil net zero house- 100% solar power and heat.
SunWizard
Site Admin
 
Posts: 1720
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:53 pm
Location: N. Colorado

Postby John Galt » Sat Jul 16, 2011 5:40 pm

I have found in lots of testing (with 3 different water tests) that PHO doesn't hold onto water (unless its cold and solidified). high FFA and animal fats do.
That could very well be true. I don't have the sophisticated means to determine if the creamy white sediment that retains water is predominately PHO or animal fats. In my case it's probably both PHO and fats plus other water retaining compounds.

I do know it's a whole lot wetter than the clear oil directly above it.
John Galt
 
Posts: 526
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2008 9:17 pm
Location: Coldest North America

Postby JR3342 » Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:07 pm

I read the ffa post I follow how ffa works against me. What I didn't find was how to lower it outside of making bio. I read some thing about baking soda lowering it. That seems easy enough. Anyone tried it with success? Also read mineral spirits will lower it? So many different theories out there hard to tell what worked and didn't. I have figured out test strips best place to start. And over filling barrels before sealing was on right track.
JR3342
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 2:46 pm

Postby JR3342 » Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:09 pm

Also figured out when it gets cool out Goin to settle and cf like crazy to stock up for summer.
JR3342
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 2:46 pm

Postby John Galt » Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:21 pm

JR3342 wrote:... I read some thing about baking soda lowering it. That seems easy enough. Anyone tried it with success? ...

http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve/forums/ ... 024051/p/1
John Galt
 
Posts: 526
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2008 9:17 pm
Location: Coldest North America

Postby David » Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:10 am

I dry my oil by pumping it back into itself in a drum under pressure to create bubbling like squirting a garden hose into a drum of water that pushes the bubbles through it.

I often wanted to process oil on cold wet days and found it took much longer or when the humidity was 100% which happens all the time in summer.
I found raising the temp of the oil helps dry it much more quickly.

I use a WVO burner I built to heat a drum of water in which I have a copper coil with teh oil running through it into my processing tank. I don't have enough of a coil in it for max heat transfer so it takes it about 20 min to get 175L of oil up to about 60oC.

By the time it is hot enough, I find I only have to circulate the oil about another 10 min and its done no matter what the weather or humidity.
As I filter the circulating oil at the same time I dry it, once it passes the HPT it's ready to pump into the finished oil IBC or drums.

I collect my oil and put it in IBC's which I cap off to stop air circulation. The sit as collected for 6months or longer at which time I pump the good stufff off the top and filter and dry it and it's good to go.
I have never had a problem with letting the oil sit without any filtering before I processed it. the crap drops to the bottom and the good oil is on the top no matter how crappy the oil is to start with.

I have found that if you do heat the thick stuff that settles on the bottom of the drums that when it cools again you do get a lot of good oil out of that particularly if you dry it. Come summer and all the oil is useable so I leave any fats I get in winter till summer amd then it's all oil so my only waste is the crumbs etc which I throw in the fire or feed to teh dogs.
_____________________

I don't give a damn about what might or could happen until a significant group of people can tell me it HAS happened to them.
Until then, it's just more endless gloom and doom Veg folk law.
David
 
Posts: 333
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2008 4:12 am
Location: Sydney Australia

Postby JR3342 » Tue Jul 26, 2011 6:01 am

Status update.
Picked up some real good oil over the weekend it was still warm. Took it home ran it thru a jeans leg filter straight into the still and next morning passed hpt smooth as glass. I guess this would be more evidence that in summer time ffa and water levels go up faster.
got some old olive oil barrels for cf that should be ready soon. Now just waiting on ffa test strips.
collected and dewatered enough to last a few weeks till everything is put together. Put it 5 gal sealed black buckets in a dark place for safe keeping.
JR3342
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 2:46 pm


Return to Vegetable oil Collecting, Filtering and Dewatering

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

cron